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My first Stationary engine

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My first Stationary engine

Post by Lewis MacRae on Sat Apr 13 2013, 21:41

Here are some pics of my Lister D which is My first (kind 0f) stationary engine I have been working on it since october but took a we break in December. Sorry about how its flickr but its the best I can do at the moment.


Homemade Gib Key remover by LewizMacRae, on Flickr


Lister D Before Restoration by LewizMacRae, on Flickr


LIster D by LewizMacRae, on Flickr




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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Ianhw77k on Sun Apr 14 2013, 09:48

Nice job Smile

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Lewis MacRae on Sun Apr 14 2013, 10:07

Thanks, the Gib key remover was made out of a close coupler (I think). When I say first Stationary engine I mean first one to restore as I have been around engines all my life and have a few already that have been passed on to me from my grandfather.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by nutgone on Sun Apr 14 2013, 11:04

Great stuff Lewis, it's good to see some pictures as well Wink

Keep up the good work. :thumbup:

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by stationary stu on Sun Apr 14 2013, 13:57

Making good progress Lewis, keep us updated on how your getting on with it.

Stui.

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Lister D update

Post by Lewis MacRae on Sun Apr 14 2013, 14:24

This is How it Stands at the moment,

Got some of the parts primed and got the cylinder head, some of the block, pulley and chain gaurd in painstripper. Also got the oak timber for the trolley & four cast Iron wheels.

The engine itself is a DH2 and went to a George McLean, Dundee on the 17/3/52.


Primed Lister D parts by LewizMacRae, on Flickr


Lister D Block by LewizMacRae, on Flickr

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by nutgone on Sun Apr 14 2013, 14:33

I've really got to get on with the Lister D I got my nephews for christmas. All these people rushing ahead with their D-types are putting me to shame!

Great work Lewis. They're a heavy lump aren't they? You'll need your porridge in the mornings! Very Happy :thumbup:

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Lister D

Post by Lewis MacRae on Sun Apr 14 2013, 16:20

Just for anyone thats wondering I wont be taking the piston out

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by stationary stu on Mon Apr 15 2013, 11:24

I have to ask Lewis, why not??

Stu.

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Lister D

Post by Lewis MacRae on Mon Apr 15 2013, 14:47

I just don't feel confident enough to take out the piston out but next project I'll pluck up the courage and take it out Very Happy

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Carpmanjay on Mon Apr 15 2013, 15:33

i was concerned about taking the crank out (like you first time playing with engines) but it just unbolts and pulls out. so u can now clean the sump out that side as well. just make sure the piston and con rod doesnt drop onto the guard and damage itself. mine didnt drop at all but i i did put some rags in the casing just incase. cant see any probs taking the piston out its putting it back in and having to compress the rings that bothered me.

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Lister D

Post by Lewis MacRae on Mon Apr 15 2013, 15:43

iagree but this is the thing, I have never taken a piston out or a conrod its that I don't really know what to do. If you could explain how to do it I might give it a go. I have a piston ring compressor and I have the splash gaurd out.


Last edited by Lewis MacRae on Mon Apr 15 2013, 17:57; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Change title)

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by nutgone on Mon Apr 15 2013, 15:54

The main problem with these engines is that the piston has to come out & go in from the top. On any engine you will get a wear groove at the top of the cylinder bore (usually just on one side), this comes about from each time the piston reaches the top of it's stroke & the con rod angle changes before it snatches the piston back down again. As the piston motion changes direction & the con rod goes from one side to the other, it causes a groove (or lip) to wear in the top of the barrel. (this can be known as "Piston Slap" because of the motion of the piston, & when it gets really bad or parts get excessively worn it will cause a noise). You also get the same kind of wear groove at the bottom, but to a much lesser extent.

So, when you come to push the piston out the top the rings will expand into this groove & can make it difficult to remove the piston past the lip (hope I'm making sense but I'm sure there will be somewhere on the internet which explains this with pictures).

Once you know this & understand what's going on you can compensate for it when you are doing the job.

These engines also have what is known as an overhung crank. Basically there's only half a crank shaft (on the flywheel end), then the actual crank, which takes the con rod, then nothing else is actually physically joined on after that (the governor & magneto drive has a hole or slot which engages in the crank pin, try looking in Wikipedia or on line for "Overhung Crank" or "Over Hung Crank" for a better explanation). So, when you remove the bolts around the back of the flywheel, you can just pull the whole crank shaft, along with the crank web, leaving the piston & con rod in the engine. Then you push the piston upwards, out the top of the barrel. But be careful, if the flywheel is still attached this is a VERY heavy lump. Even without the flywheel there's a lot of weight there as there's a big old bearing carrier made of cast iron.

Putting the piston back in can be a bit of a job, you need to be careful not to damage the rings. Personally I don't use a piston ring compressor, but I am going to get one, especially for these "top loader" type engines. If you've got one then definitely use it, it will make the job a lot easier.

If there is a deep wear groove at the top of the cylinder bore (barrel) it might be worth using a file or hand held stone to rub it down a bit, but be very careful not to damage the actual bore of the barrel further down, literally just the lip at the top, & only if it's excessive.

Hope this has given you a bit more insight Lewis.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by stationary stu on Tue Apr 16 2013, 13:13

We are all here to help you if you get stuck, thing is we've all had a first time at things and once you've done it you'll wonder what all the fuss is about.

I agree theres a ridge around the top, if you think it's to big run the glaze buster or just some wet n dry/emery (wet it with parafin first) and do around the top of the bore to reduce the ridge.

Stu.

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Liser D

Post by Lewis MacRae on Tue Apr 16 2013, 14:38

Most likely do it at the weekend as I have school and homework but If I get a minute I will have a look. Sad

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Lister D

Post by Lewis MacRae on Tue Apr 16 2013, 19:32

Managed to get out to the garage today after school. didn't get much done though but did however get one side of the block stripped of most of it's paint. Very Happy

Here's some pics of today's work,


Lister D block by LewizMacRae, on Flickr


Lister D block with most paint off by LewizMacRae, on Flickr

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Lewis MacRae on Wed Apr 17 2013, 17:22

Anyone know how to get that last few bits of paint of your engine, I was going to use a rotary wire brush but then thought it might damage the casting.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Foden on Wed Apr 17 2013, 18:54

Rotary brush will be fine, age hasn't damaged them and your brush shouldn't either. Smile

Pete.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by biomed32uk on Wed Apr 17 2013, 20:04

A rotary wire brish is fine, the ones that go in a small angle grinder are best, they are evil.

What ever route you go with rotary wire brushes safety glasses and gloves are paramount, the bits of wire that fly off come off at high speed, and will embed in your eyeball nicely. You get one pair of eyes, no goes back for another.

Safety first and second, work safe - live long.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by nutgone on Wed Apr 17 2013, 22:34

If it's a really tight gap you can use a dremmel with a sanding drum, or scrape it off with a small scraper or even an old screw driver.

I use a rotary wire brush on a drill, which is fine, but the angle grinder ones are better, just check the maximum RPM stamped on the brush is more than the RPM of your grinder, some of them require you to use a variable speed grinder. If you're buying a grinder, best to get a variable speed one, they're much more versatile.


Last edited by nutgone on Wed Apr 17 2013, 22:35; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : my "F" key is dying!)

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by stationary stu on Thu Apr 18 2013, 11:14

The wire brush for the angle grinder is a twisted knot wire wheel brush. I've listed the 2 different types of wire brushes that you can use it's up to you which you decide to use if any. Also take care when using any type of wire brush that's driven by a machine as the wires do come off and can be very painfull. Wear eye protection and a face mask (paint dust might contain lead). Wear jeans or similar when using the wire brush as wearing things like trackie bottoms made of nylon the wires will go into your pants and stay there and they'll hurt and even after washing they will still be stuck in your pants. Crying or Very sad You could wear gloves but personally I don't as I can't get a proper feel for what I'm doing when I wear them. If it's just a small area try an old screw driver and maybe paint stripper if you can get to it.

This set is for use with an angle grinder.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4pc-TWIST-KNOT-SEMI-FLAT-WIRE-WHEEL-CUP-BRUSH-SET-KIT-FOR-115MM-ANGLE-GRINDER-/280937568045?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item41692f172d

This set can be used in an electric hand drill.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/7-PCE-ROTARY-WIRE-BRUSH-SET-METAL-CLEANING-CLEANSING-DRILL-SET-RUST-REMOVER-NEW-/400338537292?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item5d36094b4c

Good luck with what ever way you decide go,

Stu.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by nutgone on Thu Apr 18 2013, 11:33

Glad to see it's not just me ruining my old screw drivers by using them as scrapers Stu! :thumbup:

Oh yes, you should still check the maximum rated RPM, which should be stamped on all rotary wire brushes, to make sure they are compatible with your machine.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by stationary stu on Thu Apr 18 2013, 11:39

Well it's sometimes not just old screwdrivers I use Embarassed affraid I know I'm norty Very Happy Laughing Laughing Laughing

Stu.

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by Lewis MacRae on Thu Apr 18 2013, 14:46

I have a pile of wire brushes for drills which were my grandas, I find the brass one are better as they don't scratch the surface as much oh ye I also have a cheapy dremmel type tool which I might try

Cheers

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Re: My first Stationary engine

Post by kevjhnsn on Fri Apr 19 2013, 01:26

i use and swear by these for the finishing clean up ,not to agressive , rips out the rust and paint ,and leaves the casting looking like a good casting
heres before

and after second going over

all ready for the primming

and there only about 4 pound each and last for well atleast 2 or 3 engines, and they only go in a drill ,less deadly than an angle grinder
there called FACE OFF black flat discs look like plastic in the pack ,but the looks are decieving trust me Very Happy
heres a flebay link for what im talking about
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-x-IRWIN-FACE-OFF-PADS-WITH-DRILL-PIECE-5-/110971198006?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item19d6661a36
i get mine from the local market stalls
kev

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Re: My first Stationary engine

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