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national F type engine

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Mon Mar 26 2012, 16:04

stationary stu wrote:If you wanted to practice on my van first your very welcome Laughing

Stu.

does t cut work on rusty old vans then Stu? lol!

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National F type 1935.............wood planer
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Re: national F type engine

Post by matt86 on Mon Mar 26 2012, 17:50

yes they do .... works a treat Smile

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Re: national F type engine

Post by mike d on Mon Mar 26 2012, 23:15

well Neville its worked on matt's van...lol.lol...

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Re: national F type engine

Post by stationary stu on Tue Mar 27 2012, 11:00

hob wrote:
stationary stu wrote:If you wanted to practice on my van first your very welcome Laughing

Stu.

does t cut work on rusty old vans then Stu? lol!

There's only one way to find out Neville, what day can you start lol! lol! lol!

Stu.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by DanBoy on Tue Mar 27 2012, 16:09

I liked the yellow stripe! Made it look like a... er.... well... a forestry commission truck. Embarassed
My Hyundai Tucson is thirsty as well, because it's an auto. I've had it mapped and added fuel cleaner. I would also recommend "Greased Lightning" engine treatment. It's american and available on the TV shopping programmes. I used to sell it (before the importer got greedy and fleeced me on the franchise) and it does work well even if I don't like the bloke who sells it. Mad
I'm getting about 30mpg now (diesel which is about five up on what it was doing.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Tue Mar 27 2012, 16:38

I'm not too worried about it at the moment, its costing about £100 a month in fuel at the moment.

Stu i would love to polish your van tongue but we have big problems where my workshop is at the moment, i expect to be working 7 days a week clearing fields on the farm for a few weeks, not even time to look at the engines Crying or Very sad

so much for being retired Rolling Eyes

neville

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National F type 1935.............wood planer
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Re: national F type engine

Post by stationary stu on Wed Mar 28 2012, 10:53

No problem Neville just let me know when you have a free couple of days lol! lol! lol!

Dan I do try a few fuel system treatments but never tried that one, the Landcruiser does use a bit as it's an automatic and perminant 4 wheel drive so I'll have a look at grease lightening see if it will help. I found out that some of the fuel system cleaners do in fact just have an additive to give better combustion etc it's the same stuff they add to the diesel that's about 10p a litre more then the normal stuff and doesn't do any cleaning of injectors/pump which is what I was looking for. In the van I add about 250ml of 2 stroke oil every time I fill up and it helps lubricate the pump etc and helps it not to be as noisey.

Stu.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by pulsechoes on Sun Apr 15 2012, 06:47

Bamfordlad wrote:
stationary stu wrote:
I had a look at the video and have to say that exhaust needs changing for something a little more suitable.

Stu.

No it doesn't. Thats a genuine National exhaust.

That's a silencer off a National "NA" diesel. I had one a few years ago, and sold it to a guy who fitted it to a Ronaldson & Tippet Open Crank.
Still see it occasionally. Mine had "5V" cast into the side, National made a "5V" engine, if I remember correctly (?). I think it looks OK on the Type F.
I had a Type F a few years ago, mine had a rotary magneto instead of the Wico EK. Mine had no exhaust on when I got it. I made one that went underneath
the trolley between the timbers. The serial number of mine was 58410. I believe it now resides with a well known collector from the Gloucester area.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Sun Apr 15 2012, 09:04

pulsechoes wrote:The serial number of mine was 58410.

do you have a date for that engine number? ..............mine is 46172.

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Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
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National Type F.

Post by pulsechoes on Mon Apr 16 2012, 17:12

The guy I bought it off told me that it was 1942.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Mon Apr 16 2012, 18:03

pulsechoes wrote:The guy I bought it off told me that it was 1942.

thanks, there seem to be very few records from the national engines around, i was told mine was 1935 but i have no idea if that's right or not.

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Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

Post by Matth92 on Thu May 10 2012, 21:24

I do like those F types, Nearly bought a tank cooled one once but it got away!

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Fri May 11 2012, 22:24

I need to change the oil in my National ............am i right in thinking that the oil drain is the bottom plug and the full level is the top plug ??


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Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

Post by matt86 on Sat May 12 2012, 10:17

that almost looks like your are correct there as may equipment at work is similar type , with the drain and filler in the same cast piece...

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Re: national F type engine

Post by stationary stu on Sun May 13 2012, 10:29

Neville with it being a bit rare your not going to get a quick answer, looking at it I think you could be correct as I've seen similar set ups before and I guess you've looked everywhere else around the engine.

Stu.

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Engines are just like Pringles .... one is never enough.  Very Happy                                        I used to love tractors all I would ever think/talk about. Then one day out of the blue I went on to statinary engines, So you could say I'm an extractor fan.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Tue Jun 12 2012, 08:12

having problems getting the F type started, anyone know which direction advance and retard are on this lever?

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Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Thu Jun 14 2012, 20:28

starting problems seem to relate to a problem with the mag so i took it off and did some work on it



all cleaned up now with a new lead and a new actuator bolt ready to test again.



_________________
Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

hob
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Re: national F type engine

Post by stationary stu on Fri Jun 15 2012, 11:02

Good luck Neville, sorry can't help I've had nothing to do with this kind of mag.

Stu.

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Engines are just like Pringles .... one is never enough.  Very Happy                                        I used to love tractors all I would ever think/talk about. Then one day out of the blue I went on to statinary engines, So you could say I'm an extractor fan.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by billypurves on Fri Jun 15 2012, 13:41

Hi Neville, Condensors can fail on these mags, the armature has to be pulled at the same time to get a good spark. If they are not pulling evenly, the mag can be moved on the mounting bolts until they do with a twisting motion right or left.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Fri Jun 15 2012, 16:51

Thanks guys, hard day in the fields at the farm today so no time to play.

Billy the mount for the mag is quite sturdy on the National with locating pins and 2 bolts holding it in place, the engine did try to fire a few times and when i tried to test firing positions at advance and retard positions on the lever i found that the mag was not working because the bolt in the actuator was too small and wiggled in the hole without pulling the mag downwards enough to click.

i made a new one with an R clip to hold it in and now it pulls down far enough to click. Cool

now all i need is the time to bolt it back on and swing the handle............ Rolling Eyes

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Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Fri Jun 15 2012, 16:54

hob wrote:I need to change the oil in my National ............am i right in thinking that the oil drain is the bottom plug and the full level is the top plug ??



i did change the oil using that bit as i could find no other way, about 3\4 of a liter ran out and i put the same back in.

_________________
Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

hob
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Re: national F type engine

Post by billypurves on Fri Jun 15 2012, 21:55

Hi Neville, You are correct about no lateral movement because of the pins....I forgot about that on the National. A mate of mine has one and he borrowed a mag of mine as his was not the best and my mag was very tight between the pins.

Advance/retard lever, if I remember it should be at the top to start....it will soon tell you anyway as it will kick!!!! Nice running engines...eventually.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Wed Jun 20 2012, 22:44

refitted the mag today and fired it up,


it doesn't run that well and stops after a short while..............seems to lack power too ??? i might take the float chamber off the carb to see if it needs cleaning out.

the shaft with the cams on,.... that works the valves has some play in it and probably needs a new bearing or whatever there is in there.
problem is i have no idea how to strip it down and rebuild it.


marks showing how the advance\retard lever affects the timing,
A = advanced
R= retarded
TDC is top dead center (as found with a pencil down the plughole)
arrow on the pulley shows rotation direction



it doesn't run anywhere near fast enough to run the planer unless i get a longer belt and try running it from the flywheel.




couple of short vids showing it running





Neville

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Lister D............ Lister domestic water pump
Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

Post by stationary stu on Thu Jun 21 2012, 12:31

It seems to be running fine now Neville, like you say you need to change the belt speed. I can't remember now but did the planner have an electric motor fitted when last used?

Stu.

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Engines are just like Pringles .... one is never enough.  Very Happy                                        I used to love tractors all I would ever think/talk about. Then one day out of the blue I went on to statinary engines, So you could say I'm an extractor fan.

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Re: national F type engine

Post by hob on Sun Sep 30 2012, 21:25

took the National to a small local show today and with a bit of fiddling and plug changing got it to run for most of the five hours









rest of the show engines here
http://s195.photobucket.com/albums/z279/hobspics/petter%20A1%20engine/mid%20suffolk%20light%20railway%202012/?start=all

Neville

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Petter A1 .......................Union pillar drill
National F type 1935.............wood planer
argosy pump
Villiers mk 15

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Re: national F type engine

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